"Defensive Shill Bidding" Dr Jim Beckett Approves

[sic698]

Massive scandal rocking the card hobby top defensive bidders exposed for shill bidding to inflate prices and protect comps! Collectors furious, trust shattered, major platforms under fire. The integrity of the hobby is on the line this could be the biggest reckoning yet.

[Soxrule111]

Yes this seems like a spam post lol.

but, no the trust isnt broken. Nothing lost. Everyone knows this happens, and on 5 figure cards (not watching the video) I assume its way more prevalent than on $5-$12 cards.

[sic698]

Originally Posted by Soxrule111

Yes this seems like a spam post lol.

but, no the trust isnt broken. Nothing lost. Everyone knows this happens, and on 5 figure cards (not watching the video) I assume its way more prevalent than on $5-$12 cards.

Claiming ‘nothing lost’ and that everyone knows this happens is dangerously naive. Look at Bill Mastro a top-tier auctioneer who served federal prison time for shill bidding on high-value cards. This isn’t some harmless hobby quirk; it’s illegal fraud. Minimizing it makes you look uninformed and dismissive of the real risks in this market.

[2010GBPackers]

Originally Posted by sic698

Claiming ‘nothing lost’ and that everyone knows this happens is dangerously naive. Look at Bill Mastro a top-tier auctioneer who served federal prison time for shill bidding on high-value cards. This isn’t some harmless hobby quirk; it’s illegal fraud. Minimizing it makes you look uninformed and dismissive of the real risks in this market.

Dude, this has been part of the hobby since forever. It happens in other collectible markets, too. Does it suck? Yeah, but anyone who truly collects knows they are often bidding against folks trying to prop up a card. It's just the cost of doing business, my friend. Sorry that you're disappointed we're not all carrying pitchforks.

[tjforce]

I feel like I'm in middle school again around some people in this hobby.

[boxbuster7]

the people at the top of the industry are all scumbags

move along

[JohnnyHatesJazz]

Thanks for the expose. Next you’re going to tell me water is wet?

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by sic698

Minimizing it makes you look uninformed and dismissive of the real risks in this market.

Hyperbolizing it makes you look uninformed and dismissive of the real drivers of this market.

You can spend a couple of hours on YouTube and see 7 figures traded at card shows. You can explore the repack market and see the amount of cash output it requires to produce these products. You can look at the wax market and see the amount of cash output it requires to continually run breaks at high volume.

We aren't being dismissive of shilling as an unethical and illegal practice. We are simply recognizing that the auction platforms are only a small segment of the hobby at large. This is not "rocking" the hobby. Nobody is furious. Trust isn't broken. Integrity isn't on the line.

It would be like saying that Blood Diamonds are rocking the jewelry industry and eroding the integrity of the jewelry trade. Except that it isn't. There is corruption everywhere. Most learn how to work around it.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by sic698

Claiming ‘nothing lost’ and that everyone knows this happens is dangerously naive. Look at Bill Mastro a top-tier auctioneer who served federal prison time for shill bidding on high-value cards. This isn’t some harmless hobby quirk; it’s illegal fraud. Minimizing it makes you look uninformed and dismissive of the real risks in this market.

It's good we now have first-hand public confirmation from high-profile figures in the hobby that it occurs. But I think most ethical people who have been involved in the hobby for years already strongly suspected or assumed it was going on. To them, it's not a surprising revelation.

The Mastro case is a bit different -- the shill bidding was being done by the auction house in that case. In this case, James Beckett is not wanting his high-end cards to be sold for less than a certain price -- he's shill bidding them to create a hidden reserve price and is willing to "buy them back" rather than let someone else buy them at what he believes is a discounted price. Patrick Ryan also talked about shill bidding cards for his friends and associates, I believe -- that's a big no-no.

The former owner of PWCC, Brent Huigens, was also publicly exposed a while back for orchestrating shill bidding on a high-end Joe Dimaggio card being sold on his platform -- nothing happened in that instance.

It seems like fraud is commonplace in the hobby, and many people who have been involved in it for a long time are acutely aware of and jaded about it.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

We aren't being dismissive of shilling as an unethical and illegal practice. We are simply recognizing that the auction platforms are only a small segment of the hobby at large. This is not "rocking" the hobby. Nobody is furious. Trust isn't broken. Integrity isn't on the line.

The auction houses do sell a large amount of high-end cards, though. For someone who doesn't swim in that part of the hobby, it is surprising to me that shill bidding seems to be so blatant and commonplace with those platforms, just like it is on eBay with much lower-value cards.

[JeffG1954]

I seem to recall that when eBay started sellers were allowed, if not encouraged, to bid in their own auctions.

[fabiani12333]

Originally Posted by JeffG1954

I seem to recall that when eBay started sellers were allowed, if not encouraged, to bid in their own auctions.

I don't know about that, but I remember that it was very commonplace and that account IDs were unmasked so bidders could see who was bidding up an auction -- they were usually accounts with 0 or single-digit feedback.

[boxbuster7]

Originally Posted by fabiani12333

The auction houses do sell a large amount of high-end cards, though. For someone who doesn't swim in that part of the hobby, it is surprising to me that shill bidding seems to be so blatant and commonplace with those platforms, just like it is on eBay with much lower-value cards.

look at PWCC - they literally had the fbi investigating them for shill bidding and they ended up getting bailed out and bought by fanatics.

the industry thrives on this stuff

[junkwaxera]

NEO and Dustin have pulled their videos on the topic. Is Jim Beckett issuing threats?


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[asujbl]

I get suspended for a week and we magically go back in time? That’s wild

What year is it now?

[boxbuster7]

Originally Posted by junkwaxera

NEO and Dustin have pulled their videos on the topic. Is Jim Beckett issuing threats?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Anybody that sells trading cards that refers themselves as a Dr. has to have a massive ego

[Bosoxfan5990]

Originally Posted by JohnnyHatesJazz

Thanks for the expose. Next you’re going to tell me water is wet?

Well, water isn't wet.

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1618862

[junkwaxera]

Originally Posted by boxbuster7

Anybody that sells trading cards that refers themselves as a Dr. has to have a massive ego

He does have a PHD doesn’t he?


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[sic698]

Too many hobby gatekeepers in here replying, and Wolf of Wallstreet card pumpers/offensive card shill bidders defending the status quo. This thread is already infested with Hogwash posts.

[asujbl]

Originally Posted by sic698

Too many hobby gatekeepers in here replying, and Wolf of Wallstreet card pumpers/offensive card shill bidders defending the status quo. This thread is already infested with Hogwash posts.

Who is Hogwash?

[majestik101]

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by sic698

Too many hobby gatekeepers in here replying, and Wolf of Wallstreet card pumpers/offensive card shill bidders defending the status quo. This thread is already infested with Hogwash posts.

LMAO. This forum is the easiest place in the hobby to generate pitch forks. It's the exact opposite of what you say. If you aren't succeeding with this thread, the problem is you.

[sic698]

Originally Posted by auctionjmm

LMAO. This forum is the easiest place in the hobby to generate pitch forks. It's the exact opposite of what you say. If you aren't succeeding with this thread, the problem is you.

Keep the blinds down and worship the status quo let’s see how long this hobby can survive with that kind of thinking.

[auctionjmm]

Originally Posted by sic698

Keep the blinds down and worship the status quo let’s see how long this hobby can survive with that kind of thinking.

I look forward to the day the hobby dies and you get to come back and say "Told you so!"

[patchgenie]

probably some mahomes pumpers