GAI Grading?

devo · 05-01-2016, 06:38 PM

I found a local guy who is selling off some of his vintage baseball collection, and some of his cards are graded by GAI. I'm not very familiar with this company as far as card grading. Are they reputable for the most part? If I was to cross a GAI card over to PSA, is there a decent chance it would be successful?

trixstar · 05-01-2016, 06:40 PM

Grade way too loosely, no one really respects their grades and I would be shocked if any of them crossed over to PSA.

joem1cha3l · 05-01-2016, 06:41 PM

Dont waste your money

devo · 05-01-2016, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devo

I found a local guy who is selling off some of his vintage baseball collection, and some of his cards are graded by GAI. I'm not very familiar with this company as far as card grading. Are they reputable for the most part? If I was to cross a GAI card over to PSA, is there a decent chance it would be successful?

Quote:

Originally Posted by joem1cha3l

Dont waste your money

I should probably clarify more; by 'crossing over' I didn't mean the grades as much as the authenticity of the card. He has a couple super high end vintage cards that are simply graded Authentic by GAI. What would be the chances of crossing an 'Authentic' graded GAI card over to PSA, even if it was just for the 'Authentic' slab?

Bretsky · 05-01-2016, 06:54 PM

You should try goggling GAI as there is some good info on it. If you get ones that are garded as "first graded" they actually are supposed to be very good and were actually tougher than some of the grading of today. The story is that the early grading by the company was very reputable but as time went on it got more and more suspect. I will say that I had a "first graded" t206 card that I bought as a GAI 2 and I wound up getting a PSA 3.5 on it when I cracked and submitted it.

coachnip13 · 05-01-2016, 06:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devo

I should probably clarify more; by 'crossing over' I didn't mean the grades as much as the authenticity of the card. He has a couple super high end vintage cards that are simply graded Authentic by GAI. What would be the chances of crossing an 'Authentic' graded GAI card over to PSA, even if it was just for the 'Authentic' slab?

My first question would have to be: why would someone who knows that card grading exists choose to send a "super high end vintage card" to GAI instead of PSA? That by itself would make me run for cover.

mjohnatgt · 05-01-2016, 07:17 PM

If the cards are already graded Authentic by GAI, that probably means they were trimmed or have severe paper loss. I would expect 99% of all GAI Authentic cards would cross to PSA/SGC/BVG Authentic as well. They are not known for grading fakes as real cards.
That being said, the 1% I would be wary of is: 1928 Fro-Joy Babe Ruth

Those cards were reproduced back in the 1950s or so, so they appear old. PSA stopped even grading them because sometimes they couldn't tell the difference. The Black and White versions could be real, if they are colored they are all fake.

What cards are they?

devo · 05-01-2016, 07:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjohnatgt

If the cards are already graded Authentic by GAI, that probably means they were trimmed or have severe paper loss. I would expect 99% of all GAI Authentic cards would cross to PSA/SGC/BVG Authentic as well. They are not known for grading fakes as real cards.
That being said, the 1% I would be wary of is: 1928 Fro-Joy Babe Ruth

Those cards were reproduced back in the 1950s or so, so they appear old. PSA stopped even grading them because sometimes they couldn't tell the difference. The Black and White versions could be real, if they are colored they are all fake.

What cards are they?

The biggest one I was looking at is a 52 Topps Mantle he has. That ones graded GAI 'Altered'. However it seems that even ones graded PSA 'Authentic/Altered' on Ebay have gigantic asking prices so I was wondering if it was worth the risk or not.

coltsnsox07 · 05-01-2016, 07:34 PM

BCCG is pretty bad too, I traded for a Unitas RC BCCG 9 and sent it to PSA and it came back a 6. I knew the '9' didn't mean PSA 9 or BGS 9 but whoa!

gottagitdemjs · 05-01-2016, 07:36 PM

Be leery of it. Many people whose cards come back from BGS or PSA as trimmed/altered end up in GAI Gem Mint holders.

devo · 05-01-2016, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gottagitdemjs

Be leery of it. Many people whose cards come back from BGS or PSA as trimmed/altered end up in GAI Gem Mint holders.

See for 99% of cards this would obviously be a bad thing, but wouldn't the 52 Topps Mantle be the one exception? There's a 52 Mantle on Ebay right now graded PSA Authentic/Altered that's already up to $8,300 at auction with 4 days left. That one is much nicer looking, but it still shows that even if you have one graded Authentic/Altered by PSA it's going to be worth a very good amount.

mjohnatgt · 05-01-2016, 08:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by devo

The biggest one I was looking at is a 52 Topps Mantle he has. That ones graded GAI 'Altered'. However it seems that even ones graded PSA 'Authentic/Altered' on Ebay have gigantic asking prices so I was wondering if it was worth the risk or not.

Does he have other cards from the 1952 set or just the Mantle? Can you agree to a price on the expectation that PSA confirms it? I know the PSA fee for this card is $700 at the $10,000 service level.

The 1952 Topps set is not one they should have screwed up confirming authenticity. Thousands of them went through their graders hands, I'm sure.

mfw13 · 05-02-2016, 12:28 AM

It depends on when the card was graded. They were pretty good pre-2009, after which they ran into financial trouble and went downhill. Don't touch anything that does not have their original flat silver label....all the other labels are from post-2009.

shrevecity · 05-02-2016, 01:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mfw13

It depends on when the card was graded. They were pretty good pre-2009, after which they ran into financial trouble and went downhill. Don't touch anything that does not have their original flat silver label....all the other labels are from post-2009.

This, their early stuff is generally right in line with PSA, back right after the change when GAI stuff was falling I made some nice coin buying GAI graded stuff and crossing it over.

NickM · 05-02-2016, 10:06 AM

Baker and Rocchi had strong reputations in the hobby, and made an aggressive push for market share when GAI started. GAI got a lot of business from people who thought they would become better than PSA, especially in California, where they offered grading specials at the major shows and were doing on-site grading.
Then things started going wrong.
Their registry never happened, despite repeated promises that it would be launched soon (Monday became a running joke in the hobby).
They were the only ones doing pack grading, but that business line took a hit when they lost some very expensive and rare submissions, and the collectors put word out to be on the lookout.
Their accuracy on high-grade vintage came under heavy attack - '55 Bowman baseball was the worst, as they gave a lot of 8s and 9s to trimmed and reglossed cards from the same couple of submitters.
Once Ryan Rutten took over the pack grading side of the business, everything went downhill fast. Ryan was a disaster who graded types of cello packs that Topps had never made (among other problems).

Make sure they're all silver flips. If the cards are high-grade, look at them carefully for alterations.
But with those caveats, you can find some nice cards at good prices in GAI slabs.

Morgoth · 05-02-2016, 10:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NickM

Baker and Rocchi had strong reputations in the hobby, and made an aggressive push for market share when GAI started. GAI got a lot of business from people who thought they would become better than PSA, especially in California, where they offered grading specials at the major shows and were doing on-site grading.
Then things started going wrong.
Their registry never happened, despite repeated promises that it would be launched soon (Monday became a running joke in the hobby).
They were the only ones doing pack grading, but that business line took a hit when they lost some very expensive and rare submissions, and the collectors put word out to be on the lookout.
Their accuracy on high-grade vintage came under heavy attack - '55 Bowman baseball was the worst, as they gave a lot of 8s and 9s to trimmed and reglossed cards from the same couple of submitters.
Once Ryan Rutten took over the pack grading side of the business, everything went downhill fast. Ryan was a disaster who graded types of cello packs that Topps had never made (among other problems).

Make sure they're all silver flips. If the cards are high-grade, look at them carefully for alterations.
But with those caveats, you can find some nice cards at good prices in GAI slabs.

Great summary, you know your history!

As far as the 55 Bowman debacle, they also allowed tons of cards with back creased to be graded without being docked at least 2 grades.

I have seen some incredible cross overs from GAI to PSA. Gale Sayers RC GAI 8.5 to PSA 9 for example. I have also seen tons of trimmed come out.

For authentic to authentic cross over it isn't as big a risk. I would make sure you do two things.

1. Bring a real 52 Topps with you so you can examine the print, cardboard thickness etc.
2. Bring a magnifying glass so you can see the print in detail on both cards.

Fakes can normally be spotted by card thickness and printing type.

05-01-2016, 06:38 PM	#1
devo Member Join Date: Sep 2015 Location: California Posts: 1,585	GAI Grading? I found a local guy who is selling off some of his vintage baseball collection, and some of his cards are graded by GAI. I'm not very familiar with this company as far as card grading. Are they reputable for the most part? If I was to cross a GAI card over to PSA, is there a decent chance it would be successful?

05-01-2016, 06:54 PM	#5
Bretsky Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Illinois Posts: 2,540 illini60139	You should try goggling GAI as there is some good info on it. If you get ones that are garded as "first graded" they actually are supposed to be very good and were actually tougher than some of the grading of today. The story is that the early grading by the company was very reputable but as time went on it got more and more suspect. I will say that I had a "first graded" t206 card that I bought as a GAI 2 and I wound up getting a PSA 3.5 on it when I cracked and submitted it. __________________ FLICKR ACCOUNT https://www.flickr.com/photos/21203319@N07/albums Fan of the Fighting Illini, Bears and White Sox!

05-01-2016, 07:36 PM	#10
gottagitdemjs Member Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 5,949 tigerwoods3423	Be leery of it. Many people whose cards come back from BGS or PSA as trimmed/altered end up in GAI Gem Mint holders. __________________ Things I need to happen in order to die happy: KU wins a NCAA Championship....CHECK...TWICE! The Royals win a World Series.....CHECK The Chiefs win a Super Bowl.......FINALLY!!!...3X!!! BACK TO BACK!!!

05-02-2016, 10:06 AM	#15
NickM Member Join Date: Feb 2013 Posts: 12,353	Baker and Rocchi had strong reputations in the hobby, and made an aggressive push for market share when GAI started. GAI got a lot of business from people who thought they would become better than PSA, especially in California, where they offered grading specials at the major shows and were doing on-site grading. Then things started going wrong. Their registry never happened, despite repeated promises that it would be launched soon (Monday became a running joke in the hobby). They were the only ones doing pack grading, but that business line took a hit when they lost some very expensive and rare submissions, and the collectors put word out to be on the lookout. Their accuracy on high-grade vintage came under heavy attack - '55 Bowman baseball was the worst, as they gave a lot of 8s and 9s to trimmed and reglossed cards from the same couple of submitters. Once Ryan Rutten took over the pack grading side of the business, everything went downhill fast. Ryan was a disaster who graded types of cello packs that Topps had never made (among other problems). Make sure they're all silver flips. If the cards are high-grade, look at them carefully for alterations. But with those caveats, you can find some nice cards at good prices in GAI slabs. __________________ 1st superfractor hit by RK Collectibles. 2014 Bowman Chrome Mini BB Chris Kohler. "What do we want?" "Time travel." "And when do we want it?" "It's irrelevant."

05-01-2016, 06:40 PM	#2
trixstar Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Seattle Posts: 24,179 stunner316	Grade way too loosely, no one really respects their grades and I would be shocked if any of them crossed over to PSA.

05-01-2016, 06:41 PM	#3
joem1cha3l Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Albany. NY Posts: 6,465	Dont waste your money

05-01-2016, 07:17 PM	#7
mjohnatgt Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Niceville, FL Posts: 14,769 mjohnatgt mjohnatgt	If the cards are already graded Authentic by GAI, that probably means they were trimmed or have severe paper loss. I would expect 99% of all GAI Authentic cards would cross to PSA/SGC/BVG Authentic as well. They are not known for grading fakes as real cards. That being said, the 1% I would be wary of is: 1928 Fro-Joy Babe Ruth Those cards were reproduced back in the 1950s or so, so they appear old. PSA stopped even grading them because sometimes they couldn't tell the difference. The Black and White versions could be real, if they are colored they are all fake. What cards are they?

05-01-2016, 07:34 PM	#9
coltsnsox07 Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 22,289	BCCG is pretty bad too, I traded for a Unitas RC BCCG 9 and sent it to PSA and it came back a 6. I knew the '9' didn't mean PSA 9 or BGS 9 but whoa!

05-02-2016, 12:28 AM	#13
mfw13 Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Seattle, WA Posts: 17,763	It depends on when the card was graded. They were pretty good pre-2009, after which they ran into financial trouble and went downhill. Don't touch anything that does not have their original flat silver label....all the other labels are from post-2009.