First Buzz: 2021 Topps Star Wars Stellar Signatures

[Ty Hope]

The SW fanbase will continue to be thinned out in my opinion. People like me who are die hard original trilogy fans but have zero interest in the new will buy less and less. I have all the original autos and have no desire to collect the new stuff. The question will become how many OG fans have left and how many new fans are they bringing in.

[ftwjedi]

Originally Posted by Ty Hope

The SW fanbase will continue to be thinned out in my opinion. People like me who are die hard original trilogy fans but have zero interest in the new will buy less and less. I have all the original autos and have no desire to collect the new stuff. The question will become how many OG fans have left and how many new fans are they bringing in.

That's an interesting thought.
I do believe Disney is gaining more and more fans in sheer numbers through new films, Disney+, Disney Theme Parks, new products, etc., but those are mostly casual fans they're gaining though. Not diehards dropping grands on product.

[Ty Hope]

I live in Japan and Star Wars is beyond dead here. Tons of product they can’t move and toy store SW sections are very small.

[Archangel1775]

Originally Posted by ftwjedi

That's an interesting thought.
I do believe Disney is gaining more and more fans in sheer numbers through new films, Disney+, Disney Theme Parks, new products, etc., but those are mostly casual fans they're gaining though. Not diehards dropping grands on product.

This is where KK screwed up. She bet the house she's bring in more money by being woke about everything and erasing the trilogy....How about tell a good story with great characters WHILE respecting what came before and let the audience naturally determine what it was all about.

So now what you have a handful of little girls that want to be Rey but its the 28+ crowd that has all the money to spend. That's 3+ generations of expendable income....

TFA did $2 billion..each movie afterwards only did half that. There is a reason for that.

[glorbgorb]

Originally Posted by Archangel1775

TFA did $2 billion..each movie afterwards only did half that. There is a reason for that.

While factual at the surface, let's not forget TFA came out years after Episode 3, so it was years of pent up expectations. I, personally, do not like the last trilogy overall, and that's fine. I am but one SW fan in a sea of many.

Overall, this is a multi-layered issue, if we're even admitting signer make-up is an issue at all.

-some "big" signers don't sign anymore (rather through decision or being deceased)
-sticker autos from people like Billy Dee and Fisher have to be decreasing (I only include Billy Dee because he typically only has stickers for some of the lower-numbered parallels lately, no base)
-new content is Disney+, which despite what Disney wants to admit, a LOT of people still don't have
-new content is in the form of serial tv shows, so no big theater experience
-new content is further from the OT, which is most interesting for people like me
-kids are less interested in cards these days
-less big signers across the board
-cheaper Harrison Ford (and others) in products like Pop Century
-to circle back to THIS thread, many don't like the design of the autos

Just a quick dump. Some small, some big, and certainly not covering everything.

Bottom line, it's complicated!

[Brobocop]

Originally Posted by Ty Hope

The SW fanbase will continue to be thinned out in my opinion. People like me who are die hard original trilogy fans but have zero interest in the new will buy less and less. I have all the original autos and have no desire to collect the new stuff. The question will become how many OG fans have left and how many new fans are they bringing in.

I'll say this, I used to think the WWE and professional wrestling would die off since it became so watered down. Yet, the WWE is still making massive profits and is possibly going to sell itself to a major network. Do I watch WWE, no, I'll tune into AEW every once in a while though. Point being, sometimes things aren't geared towards us anymore since their goal isn't always to retain, but attract. I have a three year old stepson and he loves to watch Mandalorian. A few of his older cousins love the newer movies. It'll be interesting to see if a demographic shift happens and honestly, I think the Disney Plus shows strike a good balance of pleasing long time fans with shows like Boba Fett and Obi-Wan while attracting new viewers with cute little characters like Grogu.

I'm not bearish on Star Wars yet. Also, I know you comment a lot on the Japanese take on it. I know Star Wars has always struggled in China, was it a really huge franchise in Japan? That is a serious, I have no idea, question.

[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by glorbgorb

While factual at the surface, let's not forget TFA came out years after Episode 3, so it was years of pent up expectations. I, personally, do not like the last trilogy overall, and that's fine. I am but one SW fan in a sea of many.

Overall, this is a multi-layered issue, if we're even admitting signer make-up is an issue at all.

-some "big" signers don't sign anymore (rather through decision or being deceased)
-sticker autos from people like Billy Dee and Fisher have to be decreasing (I only include Billy Dee because he typically only has stickers for some of the lower-numbered parallels lately, no base)
-new content is Disney+, which despite what Disney wants to admit, a LOT of people still don't have
-new content is in the form of serial tv shows, so no big theater experience
-new content is further from the OT, which is most interesting for people like me
-kids are less interested in cards these days
-less big signers across the board
-cheaper Harrison Ford (and others) in products like Pop Century
-to circle back to THIS thread, many don't like the design of the autos

Just a quick dump. Some small, some big, and certainly not covering everything.

Bottom line, it's complicated!

Good post. I agree with most of this. I am one of many OT Star Wars fans. I was on board with Force Awakens and than turned off with Last Jedi, big meh on the last one since the magic was gone. I do like Mandalorian.

Probably for me personally is that (and this goes with other franchises particularly Star Trek and Marvel) with all of the new content getting pumped into streaming platforms, everything gets watered down. With Star Trek, I don't really have a big desire to collect Discovery since the show is pretty terrible. With Star Wars, I like Mando and have high hopes for the Obi Wan show. Even than, with all the content the desire to collect is less since it starts to feel overwhelming. Getting one auto of some of the favorite characters feels like enough. So if you already have a Hayden and Ewan auto, I don't think the autos from the show will be much of an incentive.

Star Wars Masterworks and Stellar used to be really cool and awesome things. Now multiple sets in, they are just another yearly release with diminishing returns. I don't mind getting cheaper autos, but I can see how that is a turn off for the die hards.

[Brobocop]

Originally Posted by Scottish Punk

Good post. I agree with most of this. I am one of many OT Star Wars fans. I was on board with Force Awakens and than turned off with Last Jedi, big meh on the last one since the magic was gone. I do like Mandalorian.

Probably for me personally is that (and this goes with other franchises particularly Star Trek and Marvel) with all of the new content getting pumped into streaming platforms, everything gets watered down. With Star Trek, I don't really have a big desire to collect Discovery since the show is pretty terrible. With Star Wars, I like Mando and have high hopes for the Obi Wan show. Even than, with all the content the desire to collect is less since it starts to feel overwhelming. Getting one auto of some of the favorite characters feels like enough. So if you already have a Hayden and Ewan auto, I don't think the autos from the show will be much of an incentive.

Star Wars Masterworks and Stellar used to be really cool and awesome things. Now multiple sets in, they are just another yearly release with diminishing returns. I don't mind getting cheaper autos, but I can see how that is a turn off for the die hards.

My problem with these is the increase in price with a decrease in content/quality. Masterwork is a $200 product, no idea why people buy in any higher than that. The first year was amazing and I hit probably some of the nicest sketches I've ever had in that product. I did a case at a LCS for south of $1,200 I think (It was a six box case if I remember correctly). Product was amazing.

[eldavojohn]

Originally Posted by Archangel1775

This is where KK screwed up. She bet the house she's bring in more money by being woke about everything and erasing the trilogy....

Man, conspiracy theories have really gotten outta hand these days.

[SleepyWill]

Originally Posted by dd316

When it's laid out like that, for me all of those together don't equal one Ford.

I think long term, potentially Ewan could equate to one Ford. But, that's a long shot.

There really isn't a lot of other actors in the current offerings that have the global appeal as the initial three. Possibly Portman, but she rarely signs.

[Ty Hope]

Originally Posted by Brobocop

I'll say this, I used to think the WWE and professional wrestling would die off since it became so watered down. Yet, the WWE is still making massive profits and is possibly going to sell itself to a major network. Do I watch WWE, no, I'll tune into AEW every once in a while though. Point being, sometimes things aren't geared towards us anymore since their goal isn't always to retain, but attract. I have a three year old stepson and he loves to watch Mandalorian. A few of his older cousins love the newer movies. It'll be interesting to see if a demographic shift happens and honestly, I think the Disney Plus shows strike a good balance of pleasing long time fans with shows like Boba Fett and Obi-Wan while attracting new viewers with cute little characters like Grogu.

I'm not bearish on Star Wars yet. Also, I know you comment a lot on the Japanese take on it. I know Star Wars has always struggled in China, was it a really huge franchise in Japan? That is a serious, I have no idea, question.

It was very big, yes. Also I’m a teacher and know what the kids are into. There is zero SW talk these days and many barely know what it is. At the toy shops there was always a decent sized SW section. Now it’s gone. Just a few items left. I’ll take pics if you’re interested. Card shops asked me (as a long time SW purchaser) why I no longer break boxes and why they can’t move merch. It wasn’t as big as the US by any means but SW was big here. Nothing like China.

[Ty Hope]

Sure people were pumped for episode 7. Myself included. But if they had done a proper job with 8 and 9, the interest would’ve increased not decreased. The entire build up of ep 7 was for Luke. Literally the entire movie. Then with 8 RJ pissed all over those expectations. It angered people. Obviously not everyone, but I felt punched in the gut. I lost interest. Still haven’t seen 9. Just no desire anymore.

[Archangel1775]

Originally Posted by eldavojohn

Man, conspiracy theories have really gotten outta hand these days.

Ha, I am exaggerating a little but it's just my disdain for the disrespect the writers/director had for the OG characters especially Luke in the 2nd movie. I'm rather open-minded and actually didn't grasp the impact Star Wars has had on me until Luke's appearance in Mando. Otherwise, there were just too many WTF moments in the new movies.

As for being "woke", I mean, its thrown at your face. No reason to debate that.

As for her decision making, you do know that Disneyland's Star Wars Galaxy was originally designed after the Original Trilogy and that was squashed by KK, right? However you want to spin it, SW did not reach its potential with KK in charge. That's billions of dollars.

[Ty Hope]

Why they decided to let 3 writers have free control without an overall plan baffles me. In hindsight they should’ve just given all three to JJ. At least it would have been a coherent story.

[ftwjedi]

Has Joe Johnston ever signed for topps?

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[Brobocop]

Originally Posted by Ty Hope

Why they decided to let 3 writers have free control without an overall plan baffles me. In hindsight they should’ve just given all three to JJ. At least it would have been a coherent story.

While I’ll admit that The Last Jedi is probably my favorite Star Wars movie, I’ll agree with you on this. It was a huge mistake not to have all three movies plotted out and done by the same crew. Kind of like how Marvel tapped the Russo Brothers.


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[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by Brobocop

While I’ll admit that The Last Jedi is probably my favorite Star Wars movie, I’ll agree with you on this. It was a huge mistake not to have all three movies plotted out and done by the same crew. Kind of like how Marvel tapped the Russo Brothers.


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It really is amazing that the Star Wars brass really didn't take care of mapping out the main trilogy. I am in the group of really hating Last Jedi - reasons have been noted before and don't want to get into it. You had JJ setting up stuff in Force Awakens, RJ dismissing those and doing is own thing and not really leaving any loose ends. When watching Rise Skywalker, the first 30-45 minutes felt like a really condensed middle movie and the rest of the movie was what is 3rd movie would have been (condensed as well). You ended up with a fast paced movie with little flow/emotional impact. I think if RJ did a stand alone movie like Solo or Rogue One, the outrage would have been a lot less. He could have put his own spin on it and the main trilogy would still flow together. I guess the one good thing to come out of it is that the planned trilogies were put on hold or cancelled.

[eldavojohn]

Originally Posted by Scottish Punk

You had JJ setting up stuff in Force Awakens, RJ dismissing those and doing is own thing and not really leaving any loose ends.

What did RJ dismiss? What was JJ's intentions for Luke's self exile on Ahch-To? JJ has said he wouldn't do "angry Luke" or "cynical Luke" and that's fine. But nobody self-exiles when they're happy. I think JJ just wanted Rey to find her Yoda in TLJ because that's all JJ did was constantly reproduce IV and VI in his films.

TROS is unparseable garbage. I'm not saying TLJ is a perfect film but revisit the films in 15 years and I can tell you now which of the three movies is going to be pretty universally viewed as the best of the three and it's TLJ.

RJ tried to give Star Wars a clean break from Skywalkers -- to return this to being a story about Rey & Kylo. JJ threw that away and called the next movie TROS and just mined for more nostalgia with the Emperor and poorly conceived bloodlines.

[Ty Hope]

When Mark Hamill himself is disgusted by his own character’s direction, there’s a big problem.

[eldavojohn]

Originally Posted by Ty Hope

Why they decided to let 3 writers have free control without an overall plan baffles me. In hindsight they should’ve just given all three to JJ. At least it would have been a coherent story.

Originally Posted by Ty Hope

When Mark Hamill himself is disgusted by his own character’s direction, there’s a big problem.

You don't see any problem with these two statements?

So ... Mark Hamill should have been given sole creative control of the storyline?

[Ty Hope]

Originally Posted by eldavojohn

You don't see any problem with these two statements?

So ... Mark Hamill should have been given sole creative control of the storyline?

No. But he has been openly adamantly opposed to Luke’s direction. To insist RJ knows better than Mark himself is absurd. Mark Hamill should have had SOME creative input. RJ spat right in his face and went his own direction. If people liked that, cool. I hated it so much that it killed my interest going forward entirely. After spending the entirety of ep7 setting up a HUGE Luke return, then giving us whatever ep8 Luke was, was not clever. RJ’s insistence on “subverting expectations” is just him giving OT fans the middle finger.

Those are my opinions and everyone is free to feel how they want. My main point is that the new stuff did indeed kill off a large portion of the fanbase. Whether they make that up with new fans remains to be seen.

But going back to the topic of cards, I strongly doubt there will be another Ford level signer. The new cast doesn’t carry that type of value.

[Vargaman]

Originally Posted by Ty Hope

No. But he has been openly adamantly opposed to Luke’s direction. To insist RJ knows better than Mark himself is absurd. Mark Hamill should have had SOME creative input. RJ spat right in his face and went his own direction. If people liked that, cool. I hated it so much that it killed my interest going forward entirely. After spending the entirety of ep7 setting up a HUGE Luke return, then giving us whatever ep8 Luke was, was not clever. RJ’s insistence on “subverting expectations” is just him giving OT fans the middle finger.

Those are my opinions and everyone is free to feel how they want. My main point is that the new stuff did indeed kill off a large portion of the fanbase. Whether they make that up with new fans remains to be seen.

But going back to the topic of cards, I strongly doubt there will be another Ford level signer. The new cast doesn’t carry that type of value.

Doesn’t help Daisy isn’t blowing up Hollywood.

Now if Robert Downey Jr or Chris Pratt get a starting main role in a new trilogy then I’d say we could have a Ford rival.


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[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by Vargaman

Doesn’t help Daisy isn’t blowing up Hollywood.

Now if Robert Downey Jr or Chris Pratt get a starting main role in a new trilogy then I’d say we could have a Ford rival.


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This crossed my mind as well. Ridley hasn't done much in regards to launching stardom. Driver seems to be the actor getting good roles. Is he going to popular enough to keep prices high? I haven't checked Driver auto prices and which way they are trending. Oscar Isaac has had some good roles as well, would be a big get to get him to sign anything.

Maybe Boyega and/or Ridley will get a big movie gig and prices will increase.

[Vargaman]

Originally Posted by Scottish Punk

This crossed my mind as well. Ridley hasn't done much in regards to launching stardom. Driver seems to be the actor getting good roles. Is he going to popular enough to keep prices high? I haven't checked Driver auto prices and which way they are trending. Oscar Isaac has had some good roles as well, would be a big get to get him to sign anything.

Maybe Boyega and/or Ridley will get a big movie gig and prices will increase.

True, Driver should be higher, but also I think the ST will never be as big as the OT and Kylo was no Vader. Also, ST is still too new to have as many fans it takes a lot of time to amass generations of fans.

Also, Driver hasn’t lead another big franchise either.

Ford is a perfect storm of Solo and Jones and other memorable roles from one of the biggest pop culture decades of the 80s.

MCU would be the other big avenue for people right now and multi-film leads aren’t super common.


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[Scottish Punk]

Originally Posted by Vargaman

True, Driver should be higher, but also I think the ST will never be as big as the OT and Kylo was no Vader. Also, ST is still too new to have as many fans it takes a lot of time to amass generations of fans.

Also, Driver hasn’t lead another big franchise either.

Ford is a perfect storm of Solo and Jones and other memorable roles from one of the biggest pop culture decades of the 80s.

MCU would be the other big avenue for people right now and multi-film leads aren’t super common.


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Agree on both counts. Ford hit it big with multiple franchises. One could argue that Indy is a bigger pop culture role than Solo. That fact he did those back to back just launched him into the stratosphere. It doesn't help in today's world that franchises seem to more interested in content rather than movies.

I don't expect this trilogy to ever top the original trilogy. Probably isn't real fair either. A lot has changed since than in movie making, cable tv, internet, etc. It is akin to having another Beatles come along. Hate them or love them, but they were the first to do many things that have been come common place in the music industry. Star Wars was kind of like that. Opened up movie making to theater sound, visuals, franchising with merchandising, etc. Hard for anything to really be the movie in the right time for that kind of thing. Avatar would be the closest I guess. New 3-D technology and all that. 3-D sucks and Avatar sucked as a movie (my opinion only of course).