PWCC Altered Cards Callout Thread - 1952 Topps Mantle etc

[corndog]

***This card is not tied to OCSI or PWCC/Moser that I am aware of. I am putting it here and in the OCSI/card-buyer/HawkDynasty thread for now as I see no reason to begin a new thread.

PSA Cert #43555577

1958 Topps Bobby Hull #66

Value gain of $60,000.00


This card was purchased by an unknown buyer from Goldin Auctions as a PSA 7 for $18,000.00 on either October 02, 2016 (according to VCP) or November 05, 2016 (according to PSA).
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/h...66/74666/PSA/7

Same card was sold by Heritage Auctions as a PSA 8 for $78,000.00 on July 20, 2019.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/h...66/74666/PSA/8

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed left edge. It is entirely possible that the image pickout (offset or white snow) that is so easily visible on the front of the PSA 7 had been colored over before being regraded. The scanning contrast is much darker in the PSA 8 image, but I don't think that it would diminish the offset enough to actually hide it. The back scans show the red ink transfer (offset) from the card that would have been directly below it when being printed. It is also possible, but not likely, that the white snow is coming from a very scuffed up surface of the holder.

[Vintagecollect]

W
T
F

[Pacman69]

Originally Posted by corndog

***This card is not tied to OCSI or PWCC/Moser that I am aware of. I am putting it here and in the OCSI/card-buyer/HawkDynasty thread for now as I see no reason to begin a new thread.

PSA Cert #43555577

1958 Topps Bobby Hull #66

Value gain of $60,000.00


This card was purchased by an unknown buyer from Goldin Auctions as a PSA 7 for $18,000.00 on either October 02, 2016 (according to VCP) or November 05, 2016 (according to PSA).
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/h...66/74666/PSA/7

Same card was sold by Heritage Auctions as a PSA 8 for $78,000.00 on July 20, 2019.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/h...66/74666/PSA/8

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed left edge. It is entirely possible that the image pickout (offset or white snow) that is so easily visible on the front of the PSA 7 had been colored over before being regraded. The scanning contrast is much darker in the PSA 8 image, but I don't think that it would diminish the offset enough to actually hide it. The back scans show the red ink transfer (offset) from the card that would have been directly below it when being printed. It is also possible, but not likely, that the white snow is coming from a very scuffed up surface of the holder.

Well that’s unreal, if you didn’t show the back I would have laughed at you saying those were the same. I can’t believe the eye and the patience you have for sniffing these out. I’ve read all of these threads from the beginning and I am appalled. I have 7 graded cards, 5 I pulled myself, another I purchased locally and graded it’s a psa 1 and looks it.final one Gretzky rookie I haven’t had the heart to throw the serial number out there. I purchased it locally, but I know that means nothing

There are a few other cards I wanted to win graded but until this shakes out, 0 interest in preceding.

Thank you for all of your hard work, I really can’t believe the volume. It is truly depressing

Peter

[Pink Pussycat]

PSA needs to be gone. They provide no value, other than to card doctors and sketchy sellers. How many more indisputable examples will it take for people to realize this?

The work you are doing is incredible, and I pray it doesn't all go for naught. Just imagine the thousands of cards that were bought/traded in raw form and were then subsequently altered. Those will never be revealed, but certainly reside in most of our collections.

You have done remarkable work, given all the obstacles and odds being stacked against you. I beseech the FBI to shut this down, and keep the dirty money and corruption from winning out in this terrible scandal.

[signed79]

I knew that card was doctored when I saw it for sale.

Most PSA 10 Sakic Topps 1989s are as well.

[superdan49]

Cross posting from the COMC-HawkDynasty thread just so it's on record in here:

Originally Posted by superdan49

Oh boy, that trimmed '58 Hull PSA 8 currently sits in the PWCC Vault:





This just got more interesting.

[Soxfanguy]

Anybody got actual pictures of the vault? I bet it looks pretty dumpy

[Soxfanguy]

It was supposed to look nice but PWCC trimmed the budget

[signed79]

Also, that's snow on the card. Very common with that card/issue. That PSA 8 has been heavily recolored.

[corndog]

***This card is not tied to OCSI or PWCC/Moser that I am aware of. I am putting it here and in the OCSI/Katz/card-buyer thread for now as I see no reason to begin a new thread.

***This card was graded just three cards prior (cert #s) to the Hull posted earlier and sold on the same day by Heritage Auctions.

PSA Cert #43555574

1958 Topps Mickey Mantle #150

Value gain of $4,775.00


This card was purchased by VCP masked buyer ID r***t from probstein123 as a PSA 7 for $1,525.00 on July 09, 2018.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/b...=&limit=999999

Same card was sold by Heritage Auctions as a PSA 8 for $6,300.00 on July 20, 2019.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/b...50/65812/PSA/8

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed left edge.

[corndog]

Any further cards found will be posted in the more current HawkDynasty/card-buyer/OSCI thread. In case some are unaware, that group seems to have been more prolific than Moser/PWCC, especially with vintage card PSA 10s of which 110 have been tied to them. They were heavy volume submitters of vintage and modern with 1,000s of 10's created by trimming.

Here is that thread: https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1315750

[hxcmilkshake]

Wow. Look at all the space on the right side of the slab on that Mantle
Geesh.

Sent from my SM-N960U using Tapatalk

[Pink Pussycat]

Back in early June, PSA announced they were conducting their own investigation into the card scandal...

https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.co...altered-cards/

I wasn't sure whether this meant they are investigating their own graders, or other outside people. I am confident it is a deep-dive either way.

If it is their own graders being investigated, have any heads rolled yet? Surely at least some of their graders must have been let go, given the thousands of incorrect grades assigned.

Are we aware of any revelations? Has anything been announced as a result of PSA's important detective work? I've been on pins and needles for over 4 months now, waiting to hear what PSA was able to uncover.

Now that he's out of prison, maybe OJ can help PSA uncover the corruption, and in return PSA can help OJ find the real killer. A win-win.

[MoreToppsPlease]

Originally Posted by Pink Pussycat

Back in early June, PSA announced they were conducting their own investigation into the card scandal...



https://www.sportscollectorsdaily.co...altered-cards/



I wasn't sure whether this meant they are investigating their own graders, or other outside people. I am confident it is a deep-dive either way.



If it is their own graders being investigated, have any heads rolled yet? Surely at least some of their graders must have been let go, given the thousands of incorrect grades assigned.



Are we aware of any revelations? Has anything been announced as a result of PSA's important detective work? I've been on pins and needles for over 4 months now, waiting to hear what PSA was able to uncover.



Now that he's out of prison, maybe OJ can help PSA uncover the corruption, and in return PSA can help OJ find the real killer. A win-win.

PSA submitted a review of themselves?

Not sure how confident anyone is confident about PSA’s reviews, I hear they spend less than a minute per review.

[ThoseBackPages]

Originally Posted by MoreToppsPlease

PSA submitted a review of themselves?

Not sure how confident anyone is confident about PSA’s reviews, I hear they spend less than a minute per review.

ive done "ok" on reviews

[Soxfanguy]

Originally Posted by ThoseBackPages

ive done "ok" on reviews

14 reviews, 100%

[signed79]

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[qdoggmets]

I am curious to get an outside opinion.

Has this card from PWCC been tampered with?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1909-11-T20...p2047675.l2557

[pip]

Originally Posted by qdoggmets

I am curious to get an outside opinion.

Has this card from PWCC been tampered with?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1909-11-T20...p2047675.l2557

The card is larger than most T206s so I don't think it's trimmed. It does have a fugly cut on the top edge though. Normally (for a typical submitter like you or me) that would get a "miscut" designation. There's also some weird residual/marks near the top edge where a stain may have been removed.

Several red flags at best on that one.

[pspa123]

I like the top edge better than the bottom edge which looks curved to me.

[pip]

Originally Posted by pspa123

I like the top edge better than the bottom edge which looks curved to me.

I like the bottom edge better but yes, I agree. Possible trim/micro-trimming near LL corner.

A good rule of thumb is NOT to even consider buying anything from anyone on this list:

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1304959

[qdoggmets]

Originally Posted by pip

I like the bottom edge better but yes, I agree. Possible trim/micro-trimming near LL corner.

A good rule of thumb is NOT to even consider buying anything from anyone on this list:

https://www.blowoutforums.com/showthread.php?t=1304959

The post was for someone else’s benefit, not mine.

[pip]

Originally Posted by qdoggmets

The post was for someone else’s benefit, not mine.

Okay. Is he aware of what has transpired over the last several months? If not, print out a copy of the list and give it to him.

[ken161]

$60K on one card. Unbelievable. Is this a record for value gain of outed cards thus far? It certainly has to be in the top 10. An ever-so-slight trim job on the left edge and possibly a little recoloring. Not bad for a few hours work (if that).

Mastro said a lot of these high-value cards at the big auction houses had been tampered with at some point. Looks like he knew what he was talking about.

Never get cheated.

Originally Posted by corndog

***This card is not tied to OCSI or PWCC/Moser that I am aware of. I am putting it here and in the OCSI/card-buyer/HawkDynasty thread for now as I see no reason to begin a new thread.

PSA Cert #43555577

1958 Topps Bobby Hull #66

Value gain of $60,000.00


This card was purchased by an unknown buyer from Goldin Auctions as a PSA 7 for $18,000.00 on either October 02, 2016 (according to VCP) or November 05, 2016 (according to PSA).
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/h...66/74666/PSA/7

Same card was sold by Heritage Auctions as a PSA 8 for $78,000.00 on July 20, 2019.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/h...66/74666/PSA/8

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed left edge. It is entirely possible that the image pickout (offset or white snow) that is so easily visible on the front of the PSA 7 had been colored over before being regraded. The scanning contrast is much darker in the PSA 8 image, but I don't think that it would diminish the offset enough to actually hide it. The back scans show the red ink transfer (offset) from the card that would have been directly below it when being printed. It is also possible, but not likely, that the white snow is coming from a very scuffed up surface of the holder.

[Rooftop]

Originally Posted by corndog

***This card is not tied to OCSI or PWCC/Moser that I am aware of. I am putting it here and in the OCSI/card-buyer/HawkDynasty thread for now as I see no reason to begin a new thread.

PSA Cert #43555577

1958 Topps Bobby Hull #66

Value gain of $60,000.00


This card was purchased by an unknown buyer from Goldin Auctions as a PSA 7 for $18,000.00 on either October 02, 2016 (according to VCP) or November 05, 2016 (according to PSA).
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/h...66/74666/PSA/7

Same card was sold by Heritage Auctions as a PSA 8 for $78,000.00 on July 20, 2019.
VCP link: https://vintagecardprices.com/card/h...66/74666/PSA/8

Yellow circles are print, fiber, or chipping identifiers.
Red box identifies trimmed left edge. It is entirely possible that the image pickout (offset or white snow) that is so easily visible on the front of the PSA 7 had been colored over before being regraded. The scanning contrast is much darker in the PSA 8 image, but I don't think that it would diminish the offset enough to actually hide it. The back scans show the red ink transfer (offset) from the card that would have been directly below it when being printed. It is also possible, but not likely, that the white snow is coming from a very scuffed up surface of the holder.

Whats the long term effect on that card? Will it bleed 20 years from now?