Luka Doncic Questionable Autograph Analysis

[pcptrade]

Can we please have a civil discussion...

Originally Posted by Giantrobot

Thanks, Dickens.

Thank you editing your OP

[ilikenicecards]

Originally Posted by rogermaris

If you look closely, the autograph on that jersey is the third one I used in my original image. I chose it precisely for that reason. It does not match the signature on that card.

Here they are side by side:



Look at how tall and narrow the "L"s are relative to the "U"s, and how close they are together on the jersey signature on the right. The autograph is square and upright. The signature on the sticker is neat and slow, with short fat loops that are far apart from one another. And it looks as though it was signed by someone much more proficient in cursive. The one on the right looks like it was signed by a 19 year old boy. The one on the left does not. Admittedly, that last part is subjective...

You also have to avoid trying to scrutinize a single tree when you're in a forest. You can find an pre NBA autograph and one of the thousands of questionable autographs that look vaguely similar. But taken collectively, the data suggests there are huge differences in the two types of signatures we're seeing.

These autos actually DO look signed by the same hand.

[theLUCKYshow]

Originally Posted by ilikenicecards

These autos actually DO look signed by the same hand.

Agreed. The "l"s and "u"s on the IP auto to the right are found throughout Lukas questioned Panini autos. I think OP will lose a lot of people with this comparison.

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[theLUCKYshow]

Lets take a look side-by-side of what OP says is a legit IP and whats he says is forged (auto from NT).
OP posits that these are two distinct autos coming from two different people. I say its the same hand. You be the judge.


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[gameissued]

Originally Posted by ilikenicecards

These autos actually DO look signed by the same hand.

Hard to compare a jersey to a sticker. I don't think it matches up.

It's closer to matching this one..


Generated from my Apple iPad using tools.sportscard.trade

[theLUCKYshow]

Originally Posted by gameissued

Hard to compare a jersey to a sticker. I don't think it matches up.



It's closer to matching this one..





Generated from my Apple iPad using tools.sportscard.trade

Daaaang. Thats the best looking scribble style Ive ever seen! But no, the IP jersey auto doesnt look this.

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[SCR]

Originally Posted by M4YH3M1

As an aside, I have enquired with 3 separate forensic hand-writing services to obtain quotes to provide an official statement with technical analysis on this matter.

I will let you know how I go.

Pending the value of the quotes, I will pay for them or try to raise the funds through a gofundme venture.

I've looked into this briefly as well and would contribute to your gofundme

[RAV2773]

Originally Posted by theLUCKYshow

Now lets compare ^^handwriting with this:And a closer look at the handwriting on both:
I'm no handwriting expert but that looks like a match to me. Pay close attention to the "P"s and "r"s in both. Also notice on the bottom pic (newest photo) his "a"s can either loop up or point down, much like the "u"s in Lukas questioned autos. What does everyone else think?



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So since "you're no handwriting expert" what will you say if 3 more forensic experts say that the loopy LuLu autos are from someone different? Will you then say that forensic writing experts are subjective? Kinda like grading companies? I believe earlier in this thread someone said that they spoke and showed a handwriting specialist the different autos and they confirmed that it was done by different signers, but that wasn't good enough I guess. Now someone is looking into starting a GoFundMe page to pay for 3 more experts to give their opinion. So now will that not be enough as well if they say the same thing as the first specialist? I highly doubt that it will be the end of your quest to clear your golden boy's name, but the reality is that it should've been enough pages ago but you "can't stop won't stop" I'm hoping that we do get the experts opinion just to see what you will come up with next. Maybe a 100x zoomed in scribble sketch from when Luka was in Kindergarten that is under a magnet on his mom's refrigerator. Showing that he's made loopy letters since he was 5.

[theLUCKYshow]

lol you mad at me rav2773?

I said I was willing to chip in to have a handwriting expert examine Lukas autos and inscriptions. This is more for those who believe Luka doesnt sign his cards because for me, with the revelation that the President of Slovenia owns a l u l u auto, I will now be confidently searching for a Luka NT RPA /99.

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[rogermaris]

Originally Posted by RAV2773

So since "you're no handwriting expert" what will you say if 3 more forensic experts say that the loopy LuLu autos are from someone different? Will you then say that forensic writing experts are subjective? Kinda like grading companies? I believe earlier in this thread someone said that they spoke and showed a handwriting specialist the different autos and they confirmed that it was done by different signers, but that wasn't good enough I guess.

Lucky has moved the goal posts before and will continue to move them. Mostly recently, his mantra is "no one would ever give the president of Sovenia a fake autograph, case closed," while completely ignoring the fact that the autograph and inscription are completely different than the autograph and inscription he already gave to the president. Not to mention that this line of reasoning is so specious it's not even worth engaging with.

Never under-estimate the power of cognitive dissonance. Here's an example of what I mean by "moving the goal posts":

LUCKY BEFORE WE KNEW THE DATE OF THE UD SIGNING: "The only thing that matters is when the UD signing took place, I'm sure this was 9 months ago before he changed his autograph"

LUCKY AFTER UD REVEALED THE SIGNING WAS RECENT: "The date of the signing actually doesn't matter because look I found this super pixelated photo of one of the autographs from the singing and if you use your imagination it looks a lot like he's quesitonable signatures! This is actually evidence in Luka's favor!"

It's almost farcical at this point.

[theLUCKYshow]

I hate to say it but rogermaris is in complete denial.

And honestly just stop it with your didactic jargon.

Edit: Really? Youre now making up quotes for me? I thought you were BODA.

And when the video initially released and it was found out to most likely be recent footage, I actually admitted to how damning it looked. I "god bless"ed a few times. Then new evidence came out (l u l u auto in UD video and the Presidents loopy l u l u) and you act like its no big deal. Youre in such denial you somehow turn it around and say it helps your argument. And your handwriting analysis of the inscriptions and autos, and general take that one gift to the president was real and one wasnt, shows me that no one should take you seriously anymore on this matter. Stick to PMGs.

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[rogermaris]

Originally Posted by theLUCKYshow

And honestly just stop it with your didactic jargon.

Can you explain why you chose to move the goal posts after the date of the UD signing was revealed?

Again, this was your line of reasoning:

LUCKY BEFORE WE KNEW THE DATE OF THE UD SIGNING: "The only thing that matters is when the UD signing took place, I'm sure this was 9 months ago before he changed his autograph"

LUCKY AFTER UD REVEALED THE SIGNING WAS RECENT: "The date of the signing actually doesn't matter because look I found this super pixelated photo of one of the autographs from the singing and if you use your imagination it looks a lot like he's quesitonable signatures! This is actually evidence in Luka's favor!"

[RAV2773]

Originally Posted by theLUCKYshow

lol you mad at me rav2773?

I said I was willing to chip in to have a handwriting expert examine Lukas autos and inscriptions. This is more for those who believe Luka doesnt sign his cards because for me, with the revelation that the President of Slovenia owns a l u l u auto, I will now be confidentally searching for a Luka NT RPA /99.

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No definitely not mad at you, just head shakenly confused by your insistance that there's no way that the almighty one Luka could do something like have someone else, friend or family help him out with signing thousands upon thousands of autographs. Common sense and example after example, even video proof, lean HEAVILY in favor that he didn't sign all his autos, even a handwriting specialist was asked and said so, but nothing seems to be enough to waver you. So all I'm asking is, if we all pay for 3 different forensic experts to give their expert opinions on the matter, (and they say that it's two different people signing) will you finally give up this me against the world quest that you seem to be on?

[theLUCKYshow]

Originally Posted by RAV2773

No definitely not mad at you, just head shakenly confused by your insistance that there's no way that the almighty one Luka could do something like have someone else, friend or family help him out with signing thousands upon thousands of autographs. Common sense and example after example, even video proof, lean HEAVILY in favor that he didn't sign all his autos, even a handwriting specialist was asked and said so, but nothing seems to be enough to waver you. So all I'm asking is, if we all pay for 3 different forensic experts to give their expert opinions on the matter, (and they say that it's two different people signing) will you finally give up this me against the world quest that you seem to be on?

I pretty much admitted defeat a few days ago. Then I started digging one last time. And now we're here.

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[rogermaris]

Originally Posted by RAV2773

So all I'm asking is, if we all pay for 3 different forensic experts to give their expert opinions on the matter, (and they say that it's two different people signing) will you finally give up this me against the world quest that you seem to be on?

Spoiler alert: he's already made this commitment before and gone back on his word. Remember this?

Originally Posted by theLUCKYshow

To me it does matter when this UD video was taken. If it was taken recently, then I admit someone else very likely signed most of Lukas Panini autos.

Look what happened after we found out when the UD video was taken... now we're talking about the president of Slovenia lol.

[theLUCKYshow]

Originally Posted by rogermaris

Can you explain why you chose to move the goal posts after the date of the UD signing was revealed?



Again, this was your line of reasoning:



LUCKY BEFORE WE KNEW THE DATE OF THE UD SIGNING: "The only thing that matters is when the UD signing took place, I'm sure this was 9 months ago before he changed his autograph"



LUCKY AFTER UD REVEALED THE SIGNING WAS RECENT: "The date of the signing actually doesn't matter because look I found this super pixelated photo of one of the autographs from the singing and if you use your imagination it looks a lot like he's quesitonable signatures! This is actually evidence in Luka's favor!"

From my edit above:
Really? Youre now making up quotes for me? I thought you were BODA.

And when the video initially released and it was found out to most likely be recent footage, I actually admitted to how damning it looked. I "god bless"ed a few times. Then new evidence came out (l u l u auto in UD video and the Presidents loopy l u l u) and you act like its no big deal. Youre in such denial you somehow turn it around and say it helps your argument. And your handwriting analysis of the inscriptions and autos, and general take that one gift to the president was real and one wasnt, shows me that no one should take you seriously anymore on this matter. Stick to PMGs.


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[rogermaris]

Originally Posted by theLUCKYshow

Then new evidence came out (l u l u auto in UD video and the Presidents loopy l u l u) and you act like its no big deal.

How does me taking hours to put together an in-depth diagram showing that the calendar auto is fake qualify as "acting like it's no big deal"? All you did was post it and say, "look this is proof cause he would never do this to the president, therefore all the other evidence and videos don't matter!"

C'mon man, I totally engaged with you on that piece of evidence and showed you exactly why I thought it was forged. And all you can come back with is "Luka would never do such a thing!!" and "you act like it's no big deal!"

[theLUCKYshow]

Originally Posted by rogermaris

How is me taking hours to put together an in-depth diagram showing that the calendar auto is fake "me acting like it's no big deal"?



C'mon man, I totally engaged with you on that piece of evidence and showed you exactly why I thought it was forged. And all you can come back with is "Luka would never do such a thing!!"

Because your analysis sucked. You chose one word to dissect, didnt take into consideration the different signing surfaces, the amount of time in between signings, and OPEN YOUR EYES both inscriptions look similar! Even your fanboys are suggesting Luka inscribed the message AFTER someone else signed it.

Anyone else here besides OP think this gift to President Pagor is legit:
And this gift to the president a year later was fake?

Time to see who agrees with your subjective handwriting analysis.

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[rogermaris]

Originally Posted by theLUCKYshow

You chose one word to dissect

Tine to see who agrees with your subjective handeriting analysis.

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I chose two words to dissect because they were the only two words that were shared between the two inscriptions. Those make the best words for analysis, but the letters in the other words don't match either. It would have taken much more time to illustrate that and I'd already provided plenty of evidence.

People have already agreed with my analysis in this thread but I supposed your brain protected you from reading those posts.

[rogermaris]

And since you insist on posting those same gigantic photos over and over again, here's my response again. Notice in addition to taking the time to do all this analysis I also resized my images. I'm sure you're smart enough to figure out how to do it too. And if I can take the time to do it, there's no excuse for why you can't.



Here is the same diagram, but I have circled the areas that have the most discrepancies in corresponding colors.



NEON GREEN: 'Z' on calendar does not have a stroke through it.

RED: Bottom of 'Z' loops on calendar, resembles cursive '2'. I didn't circle but the top of the 'Z' also does not match at all.

BLUE: 'P' on questionable inscription is two strokes, real one uses one stroke.

ORANGE: 'D's on questionable inscription is two strokes, real ones use one stroke. The 'D's on the real one also loop, while the questionable ones do not.

DARK GREEN: 'K's are just completely different I don't even know where to begin.

PINK: This is the part I found most interesting. One of the features that the handwriting expert pointed out on the questionable autographs is that the signer sometimes put a little tail on the end of their "A"s, while the real Luka signatures tend to not have any tail at all.

And low and behold, not one but two of the 'A's on the questionable inscription feature the tail on the 'A'...

[theLUCKYshow]

Originally Posted by rogermaris

People have already agreed with my analysis in this thread but I supposed your brain protected you from reading those posts.

You're truly lost in a forest if you think everyone's agreeing with your analysis.

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[RAV2773]

You should make a poll to see how many members believe that he signs the Loopy LuLu autos and how many believe he doesn't. Maybe we can get a lot of members to participate. Although, members currently holding loopy LuLu autos will probably vote on wishful thinking. I know that they don't want to admit being owners of fake Luka autos. Nevermind

[rogermaris]

Originally Posted by theLUCKYshow

You're truly lost in a forest if you think everyone's agreeing with your analysis.

You're lost in a forest if you think that's what I said. All I said was that people have agreed with my analysis (after you asked if "anyone" did). I know there are some people who are so invested in Luka they will never agree with anything I post. Case in point: you.

[theLUCKYshow]

Originally Posted by RAV2773

You should make a poll to see how many members believe that he signs the Loopy LuLu autos and how many believe he doesn't. Maybe we can get a lot of members to participate. Although, members currently holding loopy LuLu autos will probably vote on wishful thinking. I know that they don't want to admit being owners of fake Luka autos. Nevermind

It would be an interesting poll for those who have digested all the new evidence.

However, for people taking a casual peak at this thread, their minds were made up on page 1.

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[rogermaris]

Originally Posted by theLUCKYshow

You're truly lost in a forest if you think everyone's agreeing with your analysis.

Just another example of you moving the goal posts again.

LUCKY: Does anyone agree with your analysis?

ME: Some people have already said they agreed.

LUCKY: Oh so now you're saying EVERYONE agrees with you?