Roger Maris HOF - Page 3

Skipscards · 02-16-2025, 02:03 PM

The case for Roger Maris isn’t about career totals or WAR. It’s about narrative. He won back to back MVPs, he held the all-time single season HR record for decades, and he was one of the best players on one of the best teams in history. Frankly, it’s a pretty easy case.

He’s a very normal Veterans Committee selection. He was every bit as great as most of the recent Vet Committee selections: Dave Parker, Dick Allen, Tony Oliva, Minnie Minoso, Gil Hodges, etc

And his narrative is stronger than all of those players except maybe Gil Hodges and maybe Minnie Minoso.

PuddleMonkey · 02-16-2025, 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Above the Rim

It is the Hall of "FAME".

Is Maris not famous ?

Did Maris not hold one of the most hallowed records in all of sports ?

Baseball and the fans deserve so see FAMOUS ballplayers in the Hall, no ?

Always exceptions to the general rule - this is one of them.

You're right, Canseco needs to be rushed to the Hall, NOW!

Above the Rim · 02-16-2025, 05:16 PM

Ok, sure. Probably better choice than Harold Baines. Oh, but wait, the PED's, er, nevermind.

bigdog2003 · 02-16-2025, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noles939913

He absolutely should be in. It’s the Hall of FAME not the Hall of Stats or the Hall of WAR. Nobody’s making a movie about Harold Baines.

They made a movie about Jim Morris, should he be in the HOF?

PuddleMonkey · 02-16-2025, 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Above the Rim

Ok, sure. Probably better choice than Harold Baines. Oh, but wait, the PED's, er, nevermind.

It is the Hall of "FAME". It's not he Hall of the Unroided.

Is ~~Maris~~ Canseco not famous ?

PuddleMonkey · 02-16-2025, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Above the Rim

It is the Hall of "FAME".

Your words, not mine. Just two famous dudes squaring off.

Donkaylove · 02-16-2025, 06:15 PM

comp---gale sayers, maybe?

Noles939913 · 02-16-2025, 07:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigdog2003

They made a movie about Jim Morris, should he be in the HOF?

Yeah shut up. Was Morris a 2x MVP who once held the HR record? Didnt think so.

49ersSF · 02-16-2025, 07:35 PM

If you are comparing Maris to a running back I'd say Barry Foster would be the best comp.

Skipscards · 02-16-2025, 07:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donkaylove

comp---gale sayers, maybe?

Tough to translate Football to Baseball but more like Kurt Warner.

jeff152380 · 02-16-2025, 08:10 PM

Terrell Davis is the best comparison to Roger Maris if you ask me and guess what he is in the Hall!
But you can't compare football to baseball.
We all know Lawrence Taylor was on coke/steroids and who knows what else every game and he was elected first ballot. Tom Brady will get in when he clearly cheated with the deflate balls stuff.. If that was baseball he would get black balled. Football puts the best players in period.. Baseball voters are a bunch of geeks who don't even know how to throw a baseball.

Carlos Beltran would already be in if it wasnt for the trash can incident. He was then 5th outfielder who didnt even play and they hold it against him.

Ive really lost my respect for the honor of baseball hall of fame of the last 10 years. Many guys elected did the same thing guys are being held out for....

OhioLawyerF5 · 02-16-2025, 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeff152380

Terrell Davis is the best comparison to Roger Maris if you ask me and guess what he is in the Hall!
But you can't compare football to baseball.
We all know Lawrence Taylor was on coke/steroids and who knows what else every game and he was elected first ballot. Tom Brady will get in when he clearly cheated with the deflate balls stuff.. If that was baseball he would get black balled. Football puts the best players in period.. Baseball voters are a bunch of geeks who don't even know how to throw a baseball.

Carlos Beltran would already be in if it wasnt for the trash can incident. He was then 5th outfielder who didnt even play and they hold it against him.

Ive really lost my respect for the honor of baseball hall of fame of the last 10 years. Many guys elected did the same thing guys are being held out for....

I'm in favor of putting them all in, including Beltran, but don't downplay his involvement. He was the ringleader of the trash can incident.

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/160...ealing-scheme/

49ersSF · 02-16-2025, 10:07 PM

When comparing Terrell Davis or Gale Sayers to Maris. Every single season TD and Sayers played healthy (60%+ of their career) they were elite. There was no random huge season mixed in mostly with subpar seasons.

Maris was a mediocre player who had only 2 seasons that would be worthy of mention. Outside of those 2 seasons, he is nearly identical to Joe Pepitone.

PuddleMonkey · 02-17-2025, 01:05 AM

first ballot lol

Noles939913 · 02-17-2025, 02:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 49ersSF

When comparing Terrell Davis or Gale Sayers to Maris. Every single season TD and Sayers played healthy (60%+ of their career) they were elite. There was no random huge season mixed in mostly with subpar seasons.

Maris was a mediocre player who had only 2 seasons that would be worthy of mention. Outside of those 2 seasons, he is nearly identical to Joe Pepitone.

Well that’s because TD was worthless outside of 4 seasons.

Bosoxfan5990 · 02-17-2025, 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeff152380

Terrell Davis is the best comparison to Roger Maris if you ask me and guess what he is in the Hall!
But you can't compare football to baseball.
We all know Lawrence Taylor was on coke/steroids and who knows what else every game and he was elected first ballot. Tom Brady will get in when he clearly cheated with the deflate balls stuff.. If that was baseball he would get black balled. Football puts the best players in period.. Baseball voters are a bunch of geeks who don't even know how to throw a baseball.

Carlos Beltran would already be in if it wasnt for the trash can incident. He was then 5th outfielder who didnt even play and they hold it against him.

Ive really lost my respect for the honor of baseball hall of fame of the last 10 years. Many guys elected did the same thing guys are being held out for....

No he didn't.

Gem10collection · 02-17-2025, 09:29 AM

WAR is a lame stat to hang your hat on. Fun fact, if you like at Trout's stats minus WAR his career looks a lot different.

OhioLawyerF5 · 02-17-2025, 09:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gem10collection

WAR is a lame stat to hang your hat on. Fun fact, if you like at Trout's stats minus WAR his career looks a lot different.

Maybe if you don't understand baseball and its stats.

Edit: I just looked at his stats to see what insanity you are talking about, and my reaction was "GEEZ that's a lot of black ink!" Thanks for solidifying Trout's greatness for me by causing me to take another look at his stats.

Ironically, WAR is made for people like you who are incapable of looking at baseball stats and appropriately analyzing them yourself.

TBTC Baseball · 02-17-2025, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noles939913

Well yeah the 1960s was an interesting time.

It is mythologized.

Skipscards · 02-17-2025, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 49ersSF

When comparing Terrell Davis or Gale Sayers to Maris. Every single season TD and Sayers played healthy (60%+ of their career) they were elite. There was no random huge season mixed in mostly with subpar seasons.

Maris was a mediocre player who had only 2 seasons that would be worthy of mention. Outside of those 2 seasons, he is nearly identical to Joe Pepitone.

Maris had more than 2 seasons. He had 2 MVP seasons on par with most anyone and then he had several other good/great seasons. He was also huge in the ‘67 World Series.

Either way, he’s every bit as good and more accomplished than most of the Veterans Committee selections.

jdandns · 02-17-2025, 10:16 AM

True about the '67 WS, but he was like Aaron Judge in the '68 Series for St. Louis and other than in the '60 loss to Pittsburgh, Maris never hit well for the Yankees in the postseason, either.

In the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame, they have a special category for significant recordings from artists who didn't necessarily have the full career's worth of accomplishments to merit regular induction, and they could certainly do that in baseball, by celebrating particular seasons (or even single game or consecutive game feats) from players who don't have the overall numbers/longevity for standard induction.

bigdog2003 · 02-17-2025, 10:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noles939913

Yeah shut up. Was Morris a 2x MVP who once held the HR record? Didnt think so.

Somebody is salty

Bhenry4 · 02-17-2025, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onions

There was a card shop in that wing many years ago. Sadly, his MVP trophy and Hickok Belt were stolen from the museum in 2016. The thieves were eventually caught, but they had melted the trophy down and cut the belt in half.

Welcome to the frozen tundra!

Treasure Island was the card shop. I remember it from the 80s before they remodeled it into a bigger space in the 90s.

Noles939913 · 02-17-2025, 02:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bigdog2003

Somebody is salty

You’re comparing Roger Maris to a guy who pitched 15 innings…

bigdog2003 · 02-17-2025, 07:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Noles939913

You’re comparing Roger Maris to a guy who pitched 15 innings…

Do they or do they not both have movies about them?

I don’t see where the Maris stats are HOF worthy. Sure he has the 2 MVP’s, but look at the margin he won them by. Not like he was so much more dominant than the other players in the league.

I get that 61 has a special place for a lot of fans, but hitting 61 in a season doesn’t change what was overall a mediocre career. Take out 60-61 seasons where he hit 100 HR’s, and he only hit an average of 17.5 a season for a year other 10 seasons.

Just my opinion. I don’t mean any harm or anything.

02-16-2025, 02:03 PM	#51
Skipscards Member Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: In Tribute To The Great Ryno Posts: 29,886 jlankf2 jmp4	The case for Roger Maris isn’t about career totals or WAR. It’s about narrative. He won back to back MVPs, he held the all-time single season HR record for decades, and he was one of the best players on one of the best teams in history. Frankly, it’s a pretty easy case. He’s a very normal Veterans Committee selection. He was every bit as great as most of the recent Vet Committee selections: Dave Parker, Dick Allen, Tony Oliva, Minnie Minoso, Gil Hodges, etc And his narrative is stronger than all of those players except maybe Gil Hodges and maybe Minnie Minoso. __________________ Go Royals!! #RoyalsIn2015 <---It Happened!! #TEAMZinck Sometimes it is astounding that we are able to persist in a world so full of morons.

02-16-2025, 07:35 PM	#59
49ersSF Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: San Francisco Posts: 3,792	If you are comparing Maris to a running back I'd say Barry Foster would be the best comp. __________________ They see what they have been told to see.

02-16-2025, 08:10 PM	#61
jeff152380 Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Vermont Posts: 2,792 Main-Street-Sports-Cards-Vt mainstreetsportscardsvt	Terrell Davis is the best comparison to Roger Maris if you ask me and guess what he is in the Hall! But you can't compare football to baseball. We all know Lawrence Taylor was on coke/steroids and who knows what else every game and he was elected first ballot. Tom Brady will get in when he clearly cheated with the deflate balls stuff.. If that was baseball he would get black balled. Football puts the best players in period.. Baseball voters are a bunch of geeks who don't even know how to throw a baseball. Carlos Beltran would already be in if it wasnt for the trash can incident. He was then 5th outfielder who didnt even play and they hold it against him. Ive really lost my respect for the honor of baseball hall of fame of the last 10 years. Many guys elected did the same thing guys are being held out for.... __________________ Owner of MAIN STREET SPORTS CARDS In Vermont

02-16-2025, 10:07 PM	#63
49ersSF Member Join Date: Dec 2017 Location: San Francisco Posts: 3,792	When comparing Terrell Davis or Gale Sayers to Maris. Every single season TD and Sayers played healthy (60%+ of their career) they were elite. There was no random huge season mixed in mostly with subpar seasons. Maris was a mediocre player who had only 2 seasons that would be worthy of mention. Outside of those 2 seasons, he is nearly identical to Joe Pepitone. __________________ They see what they have been told to see. Last edited by 49ersSF; 02-16-2025 at 10:17 PM.

02-17-2025, 10:16 AM	#71
jdandns Member Join Date: May 2015 Location: Southern California Posts: 22,550	True about the '67 WS, but he was like Aaron Judge in the '68 Series for St. Louis and other than in the '60 loss to Pittsburgh, Maris never hit well for the Yankees in the postseason, either. In the Rock & Roll Hall of Fame, they have a special category for significant recordings from artists who didn't necessarily have the full career's worth of accomplishments to merit regular induction, and they could certainly do that in baseball, by celebrating particular seasons (or even single game or consecutive game feats) from players who don't have the overall numbers/longevity for standard induction. __________________ Fix your hearts. Last edited by jdandns; 02-17-2025 at 10:21 AM.

02-16-2025, 05:16 PM	#53
Above the Rim Member Join Date: Sep 2020 Posts: 727	Ok, sure. Probably better choice than Harold Baines. Oh, but wait, the PED's, er, nevermind.

02-16-2025, 06:15 PM	#57
Donkaylove Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: PNW Posts: 3,177	comp---gale sayers, maybe?

02-17-2025, 01:05 AM	#64
PuddleMonkey Member Join Date: Mar 2019 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 3,830	first ballot lol

02-17-2025, 09:29 AM	#67
Gem10collection Member Join Date: Feb 2019 Posts: 765	WAR is a lame stat to hang your hat on. Fun fact, if you like at Trout's stats minus WAR his career looks a lot different.